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@stevarino wrote:
David in Maine,
You sure have a lot of time to type.
Regardless, I read your post from Sat Sep 06, 2008 6:14 pm and thought that for you it was a well written, non controversial opinion of Lucinda’s recent work and tour. I thought it was balanced and non-provocative. I tend to agree with you that there are folks on here that think that she can do no wrong, and that their opinion is the only opinion and if you disagree with it them you are wrong. Its kind of like telling me that my favorite Lucinda Williams song is wrong, and that I’m stupid for having that song as my favorite.
I was totally shocked when Tom Overby came on and blasted you for writing what you wrote. That is just totally wrong from a customer relation perspective. Maybe Tom does not care about customers. Customers aren’t allowed to have an opinion on this page.
Tom, you need to mellow out dude. The emotion and energy you put into that write up doesn’t make sense to me. Telling a long time fan that his opinion is wrong is just not the right approach. You should try to understand the difference between fact and opinion. You put a lot of facts out there but, why the effort. David is well informed of the tour the music, and has a been a long time fan. He was expressing an opinion. He is allowed to have one.
I even see that Pit Bull drove a long way to see a concert this weekend and enjoyed it. He is always controvesial, but obviously a huge fan. Tom, don’t piss off Lucinda’s fans. The folks typing in here probably have every album the lady put out and go to any show within a reasonable drive.
Don’t tell us our opinion’s are wrong or dont matter, they do.
Steve
OK–I’m not even really sure where to start -but Stevarino I wanted to answer your post first, as I feel that you misunderstood what I was saying. First off, I was not blasting anyone and i did not come with guns blazing-that’s why i prefaced it the way I did. You would know if I came with guns blazing. Also, I am very aware of “customer relations” as you put it, and I care very much about it. As Lucinda’s manager I have tried to do things and will be trying to do more things completely with her fans in mind. I think that there are things being done here -and things that are coming in the not too distant future that will continue to bear that out.
I think all you have to do is look back at the archives of this forum and you will see that opinions have never been stifled here. Far from trying to stifle opinions, or smack down ones I don’t like, which is an accusation I take great offense to, I am always listening to and considering them. If i didn’t I certainly wouldn’t bother reading this forum, or the forum could be removed altogether which is what a lot of artists have done recently-and for that very reason.The American Heritage dictionary definition of forum is “A medium for open discussion or voicing of ideas, such as a newspaper, a radio or television program, or a website”. I am a big believer in open public discussion of ideas – discourse is where ideas are born and problems are solved. But I also appreciate it on a much simpler level, sometimes it is interesting to discuss things, or stick a pin in someone’s over inflated balloon.
But as part of open discussion and the ability to express opinons (and facts- and yes I very much know the difference, but i’ll get to that in a second), I think that also includes the right for me to jump into the fray and express mine. I don’t know, maybe somewhere in my subconscious I am a frustrated debate-teamer. Anyway, I will at times jump in here, maybe just to discuss, maybe to stick the pin in, or maybe a line has been crossed.
And yes I do know the difference between opinion and fact, and also opinions that cite facts that are not true. Sometimes my BS detector just goes off, and when it does I may respond. But the worst thing by far are opinions presented as actual facts, which are then used to form the basis for a criticism. Its at that point that I will always jump in because true discourse cannot have the foundation of untruths and personal and negative agendas. I can take any opinion and criticism as long as its honest- for instance the difference between someone who says “sometimes it appears Lucinda treats her people badly” (honest opinion) and “Lucinda treats her people badly” (presented as fact and is pure dishonesty) is everything and is not acceptable. That is not opinion, that is a lie. And when it is, I don’t care who you are– then I WILL come with guns blazing, and I will call BS what it is, because at that point a line is crossed and you are messin’ not only with Lucinda’s character and reputation but her very livelihood. And mine. And I will always guard that. I think everyone can understand that. I hope so.Man- sometimes its hard to just sit on the sidelines and read some of the things in here with out commenting. Opinions are great, but sometimes things just a get a little ridiculous, and go beyond the pale, so I apologise if I offened anyone but I just need to point a couple of things out here.
DiM–Yes the data is indeed there and what it tells us doesn’t support at all what you are supposing. For most of this summer tour she has played the same FIVE new songs out of an 18-20 song set. I believe Sacramento and the Milwaukee Summerfest show were the two exceptions. If you go back to last year’s West tour, rarely did she play more than five or six songs from that album in any given night. So I would suggest that the next you make a statement that she is always top heavy with new songs- and it is supported by data– you might want to actually look at that data.
This is first time in her career that she’s even had new albums out in consecutive years so from 2004-2006 there weren’t even any new songs tp play. I find it quite laughable that you use that as a reason for not coming to the shows anymore. Oh yeah -that and her raspy and guttural (sp) voice. Interesting that you, as a “responsible” fan bring that up. Since she started using in-ear monitors at the beginning of the West tour the wear and tear on her voice has gone down tremendously, and as a result her singing is better than it has ever been. And that’s not just my opinion it’s also the opinion people who have been listening to her for thirty years. It has also been common opinion of several real critics who have heard the new record and seen the recent live shows, the one comment that is made is that she is singing hands down better than she ever has. And, oh yeah she feels that way also-and given the level that she holds herself to, that’s really saying something.
And one last thing, I think its really hilarious that DB’s 30-30-30 model is now the standard. Given that I saw most of the Talking Heads tours thru the 80’s and 90’s and they rarely played much more than the album they were touring behind, with a couple of odd exceptions- and the fact that only after we almost begged him– would he sing Take Me To The River with Lu to close out the Town Hall shows last year – I think David was probably being more than a little ironic with his 30-30-30 rule. But all is cool, other than you don’t come to the shows because she plays too many new songs, and you don’t like her voice anymore but still you call youself a loving and supporting fan. With love and support like that how can you fail. She needs a lot more like you.Howa- Man -you really got me with your post. You said that you were disappointed because she didn’t play very much that was pre-Essence, which left me confused why you drew the line there, because there are only 3 albums prior to Essence (not counting the Folkways records) CWOAG, SOW and LW. But then I read your post again and realised that those were the albums YOU actually owned (and WWT, but apparently you don’t like that one because you drew the line at Essence). So let me get this straight, you go to a Lucinda show in 2008 and and are disappointed because she doesn’t play enough of 3 albums that are 10-20 years old, and this is what really kills me, the songs that she did play from those records just happened to be the songs YOU didn’t like. Unbelievable. You know I completely accept that everyone is entitled to their opinion, but going to a show with those restrictions/expectations was just a little unrealistic. I kind of feel sorry for you because you had nowhere to go but down- you basically had no chance of liking the show. It like planning a trip to Las Vegas and getting there and being disappointed because there are all these big hotels and casinos. And on that note maybe in the future you should go to shows at casinos, because you are a lot more likely to get a golden oldies set there -that’s where people play when they get lost in the past.
