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@illbeyou wrote:
The discussion got ridiculous, didn’t it?
It started ridiculous – it got worse!
Simple facts:
1. To some people Lu isn’t as good as she used to be.
2. To other people, she is better than ever.
3. Both of these facts are true, but only because they assert that people hold these onions.
4. Whether Lu is in fact better or worse than she was at any other point is purely subjective.
5. Subjective facts are NOT worth arguing about with the vitriol and ad hominum attacks used in this thread.So can we all have a nice cup of tea and agree to differ? Thanks.
I’ve read the other posts on this thread (some are pretty scary) and I’ve also received some personal messages (most very thoughtful) from other members. I will say that when it comes to alcohol and drugs there are those who know what’s going on, those who don’t know what’s going on and many who wonder what the hell? Here’s an excerpt from my message to another member:
Thank you for you most thoughtful email. Just so you know, I’ll be clean and sober 22 years on December 8th. (If I make it…) Not being part of her entourage I can be a little more blunt and frank without having to worry about the repercussions. I’ve seen Lucinda bombed out her mind backstage on at least four occasions: at Santa Cruz five years ago, the Mountain Winery in 2005 and 2006, and in Santa Rosa in 2006. FYI… it was back stage at the Santa Rosa show when I was talking with Lucinda and the daughter of a famous blue musician (who’s in recovery) when I pulled out my AA chip and said her father and I belong to the same club. I watched the blood drain from Lucinda’s face… like she’d just seen a ghost. It was sheer fear. I’m sure the thought of going on tour and performing without taking anything terrifies her beyond compare. I remember before I got sober…I couldn’t imagine doing anything without drinking (or drugs)… Recovery is hard and nobody checks into AA early. But once you cross over the line, there’s no more booze, pot, coke et al. PERIOD. The trade-off is your life gets a whole lot better once you realize you DON’T need the self-medication to be a productive artist. I can name at least 25 other famous musicians who are in recovery and are still making great music. So it’s not the end… but a beginning.Good posts Pit Bull. I guess you are going to tell us what you meant by change Peter to Paul someday. Or maybe I don’t want to know.
The Ventura and LA shows were both fantastic and LW seemed super happy. I saw her after the Ventura show and she seemed quite normal. That’s all I can say first hand.
happy thanksgiving to everyone here in the U.S.
here’s a story that inspires me every day of the yearhere’s to another year of inspiration
lisahttp://www.venturacountystar.com/news/2008/nov/26/boy-turns-lifes-
lemons-into-lemonade/Boy turns life’s lemons into lemonade
Stand will benefit Childrens Hospital
From staff reports
Wednesday, November 26, 2008
Eric Parsons / Star staff. Camarillo 11/23/06.Persistent and charming, Alexander Riach pleaded with passing
motorists along Upland Rd. to stop at his lemonade stand. “Come get
your delicious lemonade for Childrens Hospital!”If it’s Thanksgiving in Camarillo, it’s becoming a safe bet that you
will find young Alexander Riach out on Upland Road selling his
lemonade.This will be the fourth Thanksgiving in a row that Alexander, just
9, will be offering up refreshing cups of lemonade to customers, who
often pay far more than two bits apiece for them. It is not
uncommon, in fact, to see someone ask for two cups of lemonade and
hand over a $100 bill.As those familiar with Alexander and his special annual lemonade
stand know, the effort really is an ultimate act of thanksgiving.Alexander is raising money for a cause very close to his heart: Los
Angeles Childrens Hospital and the Ronald McDonald House.When Alexander was 2, he was diagnosed with Guillain-Barre syndrome,
which causes paralysis and loss of motor nerve function. He spent
nearly three months in intensive care at Los Angeles Childrens
Hospital and a year in outpatient therapy relearning all his motor
skills.Today, his mom Suzie says, “he’s perfectly fine.”
“Alexander was inspired to start his lemonade stand from a story I
had read him in Guidepost magazine several years ago about a little
girl named Alexandria Scott who died of cancer at age 7, in October
2004,” Suzie said Saturday. “She had battled cancer since she was 6
months old. When she was about 5 years old, she begged her mom to
help her set up a lemonade stand in front of her house in which she
decided to raise $1 million to help find a cure to all childhood
diseases.“Now my Alexander has also decided that he will follow in her
footsteps and help to keep her dream alive,” Suzie said. “He, too,
is determined to reach the $1 million mark.”Over the past three years, Alexander has managed to raise almost
$10,000. This year, his goal is to raise $6,000 more, his mother
said.“A child’s determination never ceases to amaze me,” she said. “They
are capable of such greatness.”From 9 a.m. to 1 p.m. on Thanksgiving Day, Alexander will man the
stand in his usual place — on Upland Road between Lewis and Flynn
roads.“We’re there,” Suzie said. “Rain or shine.”
This year, Alexander’s uncle plans to be on hand, as well, to
perform magic tricks.“We can’t wait to see the fantastic people who have come every year
as well as meet lots of new people and hear their stories,” Suzie
said. “We have been very touched by many of the things we have heard
from others who have benefited from Childrens Hospital.”Those who would like to donate but are unable to visit the lemonade
stand on Thanksgiving can send donations to Alexander Riach, c/o
Childrens Hospital, 4936 Verdugo Way, Box 242, Camarillo, CA 93012.Since seeing Lucinda earlier this month two nights in a row and absolutely loving it – I’ve been checking this forum more often because I enjoy hearing what everyone has to say. I don’t know anyone who loves LW as much as I do so it’s awesome to share stories and opinions on here with others who have the same passion for LW’s music.
This particular thread bothered me though because although I believe a forum is an open place for everyone to share opinions – I don’t feel sharing opinions about LW’s possible habits is appropriate. Anyone who may or may not know anything about LW as a person – in my opinion – has no right airing her dirty laundry. When is it ever ok to share this kind of info about other people? LW is just trying to get along in a world like the rest of us. It always amazes me that she can even get up there and do what she does – night after night – and do it so beautifully. Each of us has gifts, demons, strengths, quirks – all of which are integral parts of who we are. We make choices in our own lives to go on whatever path we think is best for us. No one can make these choices for us.
Pitbull, I respect your honesty about your life and wish you continued success with your endeavors. However, any judgement on LW’s lifestyle is unfair and unfounded. I don’t care how many times you’ve seen her back stage – you don’t really know the ins and outs of the life she lives. And more importantly it’s none of our business and I believe shouldn’t be up for discussion on here. Your original post was disappointment with her show and that’s cool – I agree with philty – there is no right or wrong opinion about whether LW is better now or before. It will always be a subjective conversation to which all opinions are welcome and necessary to make this forum work.
@troberts wrote:
Pitbull, I respect your honesty about your life and wish you continued success with your endeavors. However, any judgement on LW’s lifestyle is unfair and unfounded. I don’t care how many times you’ve seen her back stage – you don’t really know the ins and outs of the life she lives. And more importantly it’s none of our business and I believe shouldn’t be up for discussion on here. Your original post was disappointment with her show and that’s cool – I agree with philty – there is no right or wrong opinion about whether LW is better now or before. It will always be a subjective conversation to which all opinions are welcome and necessary to make this forum work.
I could not agree more. Well said.
Tom
I’m hardly passing judgment on Lucinda. I’m merely pointing out a real problem (disease) that if she continues to ignore will only get worse. Maybe this forum isn’t the place for a half-ass intervention. But perhaps by putting the topic out in the open others (closer to her) might be able to approach her.
I also understand that even people who are closest to Lucinda won’t be able to get through, until she’s ready to admit she has a problem. Denial is one of the ego’s strongest self-defenses. And until a person hits his or her own bottom (or has a moment of clarity) all efforts to change somebody are pretty much a waste of time.
I will pass along a piece of advice I’ve gotten from other addicts and alcoholics in recovery: “You’re only as sick as your secrets.” And if Lucinda chooses not to do anything about this secret, that’s her choice. A choice, that sadly means she’ll be the last person to know it’s not a secret anymore.
Pit Bull,
Just because Lu (allegedly) likes a drink does not mean that she automatically has a problem.
I have drank alcohol on a regular basis for years and occasionally been extremely drunk as a result of it. but I do not consider that I have a problem and certainly not a disease! Not everyone that drinks regularly, nor everyone that gets a little too drunk once in a while is a raging alcoholic that needs to ‘admit they have a problem!’ I can quite happily go for days or even weeks without a drink, and often do, but I enjoy a few drinks with friends and sometimes, rarely, if the mood is right, I enjoy having a few too many – although not necessarily the day after! I appreciate that some people, yourself included, have serious problem with alcohol and I respect your honesty in sharing that with us here. However, please don’t assume that every time you see a fellow human being inebriated they are necessarily in denial and need to take the cure!
Specifically, I believe that you are out of order to assume that Lucinda has such issues merely because you have seen her drunk a few times. And further, I believe that you are seriously out of order to publicise what is in fact nothing more than your opinion of anyone on a public forum like this.
And even if she does have a drink problem, not that it is anyone’s business but hers and those close to her, I am sure that you realise that she needs to admit that herself first and that nothing anyone else does can make a difference until she does. So what exactly are you hoping to achieve by making such proclamations, except to stir up trouble?
They do say that there are no worse zealots than the recently converted. I believe that we may be seeing a little of that from you here.
@Philthy wrote:
I have drank alcohol on a regular basis for years and occasionally been extremely drunk as a result of it. but I do not consider that I have a problem and certainly not a disease! Not everyone that drinks regularly, nor everyone that gets a little too drunk once in a while is a raging alcoholic that needs to ‘admit they have a problem!’ I can quite happily go for days or even weeks without a drink, and often do, but I enjoy a few drinks with friends and sometimes, rarely, if the mood is right, I enjoy having a few too many – although not necessarily the day after!
Philthy,
You and I need to meet up for a drink or three – you sound like my kind of fellow. If you ever find yourself in Atlanta, look me up… 😆 😉 😀
Tom
I hate to spoil the party… so I’ll let each reader decide for his or herself. If you think you have a problem (you probably do). I’ve also listed some places where you can go for help:
Are You An Alcoholic?
The first sign that you may have a problem with alcohol is the fact you’re even toying with the question. But don’t be afraid to ask because the first step in dealing with the issue is to recognize that the problem even exists and then admit you need help.How can you tell if your alcohol use has turned into alcohol abuse? Read these warning signs from the Mayo Clinic and honestly ask yourself if they apply to you.
10 Warning Signs of Alcohol Abuse
1. You drink specifically to become intoxicated.2. You prefer to drink when you’re alone or keep your alcohol consumption a secret.
3. You drink alcohol as a way to deal with or escape from your problems.
4. You stash alcohol in unlikely places.
5. You become irritable if alcohol is unavailable when you want a drink.
6. You have a ritual of drinking at certain times of the day and become upset if this ritual is disturbed.
7. You have lost interest in the hobbies and activities you used to enjoy.
8. Problems have arisen at work, school, home, or with the legal system because of your drinking.
9. You frequently experience memory loss or blackouts as a result of heavy drinking.
10. You become annoyed when friends, family members or loved ones say you have a drinking problem.
If two or more of these statements sound like you, the bad news is that you likely do have an alcohol abuse problem. However, this doesn’t necessarily indicate an alcohol addiction. According to the NIAA, alcoholics will also experience these four symptoms:
4 Warning Signs of Alcoholism
1. An increasing tolerance to alcohol.2. The inability to stop drinking once you start.
3. Strong urges or cravings to drink.
4. Experiencing withdrawal symptoms such as anxiety, nausea, shakiness, and cold sweats when you don’t have a drink.
Help For Your Drinking Problems
Alcoholism is a deadly and devastating disease. It affects sufferers mentally, physically, emotionally, and perhaps even spiritually. If you attempt to stop or control your drinking and find that you can’t do it alone, it’s time to get help. Enlist the aid of a loved one, or seek professional guidance.Here are the phone numbers of three alcoholism support groups that can help put you on the path to full recovery:
Alcoholics Anonymous
alcoholics-anonymous.org
(212) 870-3400National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism
niaaa.nih.gov
(301) 443-3860National Council on Alcoholism and Drug Dependencies
ncadd.org
(212) 269-7797And finally, here’s how I got right with god:
god grant me the serenity
to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the differenceThat is all very well PB but you have NO evidence that Lu is showing any of those warning signs. All you know is that you have seen her drunk, in the company of others I might add, after a few shows. I saw again that the conclusions that you have drawn from that are purely speculative and constitute solely YOUR opinion, not fact.
As such, you are wrong to voice them in a public forum.
And furthermore, I very much hope that you are wrong.
Sounds like the board is addressing two different issues: LWs music and chemical dependency with the latter being especially slippery and way serious/dangerous. I, too, have wondered about these things and have seen several emotional and somber scenarios play out both backstage and front-of-house as well. None of my business, really, I just honor and respect the pain that everyone carries–some knowing and trusting self-medicating as a resource regardless of its outcome(s). Plato said “Be kind to everyone you meet, for everyone is fighting a hard battle.” We move to judgement so quickly. It’s true, everyone has there own stuff/junk to carry while some are more effective than others. After all and some say that it’s really about “attraction rather than promotion” in terms of our option-sets for such mind-blowing condundrums. As far as fan sites and message boards are concerned–the Internet in general–I am always amazed by the amount of reality that its users try and interject into their interactions here. In a recent cartoon two dogs were depicted sitting at a computer screen where one said to the other–“Nobody knows I am a dog on the Internet.” It’s interesting how serious people take themselves on the sites such as these. All this stuff certainly speaks volumes about today’s American psychological processes at the very least…
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