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Good post Steverino,
I just got back from the LA show. It was a great show. And since it was the tour finale, it literally is my last Lucinda concert, for a while anyway.
Sounds like we need Whambulence for the cheerleader section of this board: “nobody understands us but us–especially as it relates to LWs music and concerts–she can do know wrong–best voice ever” and so forth. Thanks, for grouping me with the “they” not the “we” part of this board. I like the “see–I told you” part of the post. Sandbox rules, rule! If I don’t hear what I like, I’m telling and taking my toys home! Glad that your world begins and ends so simply and without critical thought. What ever happened to life long learning and exploration? Concert attendance is data and the data is telling us something. Finally, this board is a fan-based board so it is, by nature, stilted and unbalanced. So, enjoy the unbalanced nature of things.
I’d enjoy it a lot more if you weren’t so condescending and arrogant. You didn’t go to the show. We did. We liked it. Let it go.
Who is we? How can you speak for others? Do you have the permission to be the voice of others? My posts are not condescending or arrogant. On the contrary they are well-crafted, thoughtful, and intelligent. Just because my posts don’t reflect and/or ooze a fanatical view of the latest tour/album, this does not necessarily devalue their accuracy or inherent value. If my posts accused someone of being condescending and arrogant in addition to advising him/her to “let it go,” than my posts would indeed be condescending and arrogant. There are many valid opinions and I choose to voice mine in a professional, tightly woven, and non-confrontational way. Glad you like reading them as well–it is quite evident in terms of your reactive emotionality. Thanks, for the vote of confidence!
David in Maine
Everything you type is the total opposite of what you say.
Tell us something positive about a band or some music you like.
Steve
Maybe it’s time to just tell it like it is: Not only should Lucinda stop touring for a while she should also check into rehab. The constant touring has taken a toll on her act. And her continued abuse of booze and “recreational” drugs has taken a toll on her. She’s not alone: Lucinda has surrounded herself with users on the road. Have you ever noticed how alcoholics and addicts surround themselves with other alcoholics and addicts so no one can call them on their self-medication or bullshit? It’s hard to admit you have a problem when everyone is blowin’ smoke up your ass about how great you are. Which in Lucinda’s case is true. She’s an amazingly gifted singer-songwriter. How else could’ve she written a song like “Drunken Angel?” She says it’s about Blaze Foley. And over the years, she’s said it could also be about Townes, Kurt, Jim, Jerry, and Janis et al. These days when I hear her perform Drunken Angel I think it’s about her. Also, you don’t come clean (or get sober) from writing a song like Jailhouse Tears. You come clean and get sober by checking into rehab. It’s not a sign of weakness. It’s a sign of strength. Her view of musicians, who’ve died for their drug and drink, as martyrs and tragic figures may help create a great song, but it’s not the path to a healthy or very long life. The fact is, most were just too sick (in denial) and didn’t know how to stop using or get well. And unfortunately, no one had the guts to tell them, until it was too late. So let this be a wake-up call to Lucinda and all of those who truly have her best interests at heart. Take an extended break, get well, and come back stronger than ever. You don’t need the money. But we need your music.
P.S. In case you’re wondering… over the years I’ve been on the road, in the audience, backstage, and talked to a “drunk” Lucinda enough times to see the decline. Not to mention, that I have lots of dead addict friends whom I miss (some more than others).
P.P.S. To illbeyou: Best show: HOB New Orleans 9-22-03. Best album: Essence
Well said, PB. Courageous, indeed. LW does seem that she carries a good deal of pain on her shoulders. And Steve, here are a few of the songs/artists/shows on my mind: David Byrne Feelings Tour with Coolbone opening: Hyannis and Cleveland shows. David Byrne My Backward Life Tour with Juana Molina Opening: Berkelee and Concord, NH. Lucinda Williams with the Jayhawks opening: Portland, ME. Lucinda Williams at 1st Ave: Fall 1989 2 shows–opening for Gram Parker, then several weeks later as a headliner. Lucinda Williams–1st leg of CWOGR with Kenny Vaughn on guitar w/Jim Lauderdale as an opener and backup vocalist–Somerville, MA. Lucinda Williams–Essence tour with Charlie Sexton, Bo Ramsey, and Doug Pettibone–Portland, ME, Cleveland and Concord, NH. Talking Heads-Detroit–Stop Making Sense. Lou Reed–Magic and Loss tour MPLS–State Theater. Prince–Diamonds and Pearls: Super Bowl Weekend 1991 at his now closed club Glam Slam. Bo Diddley and Bill Kirchen of Too Much Fun–HOB New Orleans–1996. And so forth.
Dim – You are condescending and arrogant. Your posts prove that. Calling other fans “cheerleaders”, “rabid”, and “fanatical” is condescending.(Don’t you agree?) Trying to come off as a superior fan is arrogant. (yes, that is what you are doing.) I am going to join stevarino in warning others about your negativity. There’s a guy on the Tom Petty Messageboard who posts messages like yours. He manages to get everybody riled up, too. I’m done responding to you. I encourage everyone else to follow suit. Maybe you’ll go away.
PB – you told me what your favorite show and concert are, but you didn’t say what makes them stand apart from her latest work. How was your favorite show different that Sunday night at the Fillmore? For that matter, how was it different the her last few times at the Fillmore? I must have missed some exceptional tours in her early years, because I have seen some great shows since I became a fan. I became a casual fan upon hearing Car Wheels, but my fondness and respect for her as a musician came after seeing her live.
Explain this “decline” you write about. Do you think Lucinda is doing more than drinking and smoking? You put “recreational” in quotes like you are intentionally understating the severity. The dead rockers you mentioned were all into more than “recreational” drugs, correct?
I have been intentionally staying out of this discussion after my initial post because I felt that there was no point any more; i.e., no minds were going to be changed. But, after the latest “twist” in the discussion, I feel compelled to point out that what Lu does in her personal life is her business. And furthermore, she does not deserve, in my honest opinion, such unfounded and rampant speculation about what she does or does not do off stage & outside the recording studio. Good Lord, this is starting to sound like some kind of supermarket tabloid or something. Next, I suppose someone will start gossiping about her sex life for Pete’s sake… 🙄
Tom
Well TNT it’s not speculation just first-hand observations from one who knows…
“Next, I suppose someone will start gossiping about her sex life for Pete’s sake…”
And since you brought her sex life up….if you replace Pete with Paul you’ve hit the nail right on the head. A married man no less… To use one of your favorite Lucinda quotes: “If you hang around with trash you can’t come out clean.”
arm pitbull shit and davidinane you are judgemental XXXXXXX. Who the fuck are you to judge Lucinda ? Neither of you could carry her bra. If you don’t like the shows don’t go and keep your shitty attitudes to yourselves. Go post your worthless opinions on the “We Stand In Judgement of Others” website. I hope you filthy scumbags die.
So Lefty. Are you gonna delete my post just because I use hateful curse words ? Are you a censor or a moderator ?
ilbu, tntcy et al:
Just a few reminders and housekeeping notes (notice no “smiley” faces):
1) This is a anonymous forum where adults (I hope) post ideas about Lucinda Williams and her music. With this in mind, such perspectives may vary so be advised. Also, this is not a real reality. It’s a freakin’ message board, yo. Yo.
2) These adults (?) then use somewhat questionable and made-up names/personas as they communicate with each other in various role play scenarios akin to a Dungeons and Dragons or World of War Craft fantasy play. Wow, are you off yet?
3) Although they may never meet, they may form clans that then bully and harass others that do not conform to their set–although imaginary–rules. Sandbox rules per say. Yeah, aren’t we great and isn’t this really the best!?
4) If one does not conform to the all-or-nothing mindset, all bets are off and one is then voted off the island by one–who often speaks for “us.” Recently, the Tom Petty crew was brought into the blog, which really heightens the I’m gonna tell mentality–hopefully Benmont Tench stays out of the fray or we’ll all be in the sh*tter!
Anyway, wishing LW all the best and many thanks, for all you have done to mend my broken heart–you have really helped me to learn how to point to the moon. In other words:
I walked out in a field, the grass was high, it brushed against my legs
I just stood and looked out at the open space and a farmhouse out a ways
And I wondered about the people who lived in it
And I wondered if they were happy and content
Were there children and a man and a wife?
Did she love him and take her hair down at night?If I stray away too far from you, don’t go and try to find me
I doesn’t mean I don’t love you, it doesn’t mean I won’t come back and
stay beside you
It only means I need a little time
To follow that unbroken line
To a place where the wild things grow
To a place where I used to always goBut, after the latest “twist” in the discussion, I feel compelled to point out that what Lu does in her personal life is her business. And furthermore, she does not deserve, in my honest opinion, such unfounded and rampant speculation about what she does or does not do off stage & outside the recording studio.
I concur. I don’t think any topic should be off-limits, necessarily, but I think on a site such as this one it’s appropriate to consider what the purpose of posting such speculation would be. If you want to comment on what you’ve noticed at shows, there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that. But if you’re privy to some kind of inside information that you can’t share, I think it does Lucinda a disservice to allude to it.
My two cents, based only on what I’ve witnessed at shows I’ve attended, is that I’ve seen shows where she was obviously a bit inebriated by the end of the show* and I’ve seen shows where she appeared sober at the end. At none of the shows I’ve seen have I ever thought that the quality of the performance suffered or that she was out of control. She apparently likes to drink; nothing wrong with that even during a show. And at the risk of engaging in some speculation of my own, I think it’s safe to say that she’s not always at ease performing onstage and a drink or two probably helps in that regard. I’d have no problem saying that her drinking was problematic from a performance standpoint if I saw it that way (I have some comical recordings of Bob Dylan circa 1991 that illustrate problem drinking in relation to performing), but I don’t.
I’ve never witnessed anything that implied she was under the influence of anything stronger than alcohol.
* Hopefully this anecdote won’t offend anyone…I remember the Madison show in ’06, for which I was lucky enough to be in the front row. She accidentally knocked her drink over at one point and the smell of alcohol was overpowering. My girlfriend nudged me and said “if the roadies drop a cigarette on that rug later, it’ll go up in flames.” 😀
As an aside I received my Paste magazine last week. They chose to print the Album sales ratings from the week Little Honey was at number nine in sales. The comment in the #9 box was that it was her best album since Car Wheels, which I happen to agree with. If that makes me a “cheerleader” or “fanatic” in someones opinion, so be it. We all have opinions, and they are valid. We should probably tone down the rhetoric and insults, that’s not really why I like to come in here and read what you all write.
What do we know about the 2009 tour so far?
Steve
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